AMOL Spoiler Qs

[TB]

Spoilers for PP 827-829 of AMOL:
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During the Last Battle, the 500 people of Hinderstap, backed up by 100
Band of the Red Handers, sally forth to battle the Trollocs at a
river. Of course, they are all slaughtered. Then the next morning at
dawn, Jur Grady makes a Gateway to Hinderstap, and the resurrected
populace of Hinderstap, plus the Red Handers, pour through the Gateway
to attack the stunned Dreadlords! They kill the Dreadlords, allowing
Jur to undam the river to flood out a bunch of Trollocs downriver. On
that very same day at noon, Rand reforges the DO's prison, cutting him
off from the world. Did the Hinderstap resurrection spell last long
enough to resurrect the Hinderstappers and the Rand Handers the
morning AFTER the Last Battle?

How did the Red Handers get trapped in Hinderstap anyway?

[Chucky @ Work]

On Mon, 11 Mar 2013 22:50:09 -0700 (PDT), TB

Post by TB
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During the Last Battle, the 500 people of Hinderstap, backed up by 100
Band of the Red Handers, sally forth to battle the Trollocs at a
river. Of course, they are all slaughtered. Then the next morning at
dawn, Jur Grady makes a Gateway to Hinderstap, and the resurrected
populace of Hinderstap, plus the Red Handers, pour through the Gateway
to attack the stunned Dreadlords! They kill the Dreadlords, allowing
Jur to undam the river to flood out a bunch of Trollocs downriver. On
that very same day at noon, Rand reforges the DO's prison, cutting him
off from the world.

What I was wondering was, presumably before those people were
resurrected in Hinderstap and came back out of the gateway to attack
all over again, their bodies would have vanished from the previous
attack. So unless the Dreadlords wiped them all out completely (no
bodies), there would have been some mysterious body-vanishings.

At the very least, some suddenly-hungry Trollocs as their dinner
vanished.

Post by TB
Did the Hinderstap resurrection spell last long
enough to resurrect the Hinderstappers and the Rand Handers the
morning AFTER the Last Battle?

There's the question, sure enough. If the bubble was still active and
that was what was resurrecting them, then it would have stopped when
the Dark One was sealed off, and they would all remain in whatever
state (dead or alive, but not perpetually-looped) they were in at that
moment. Sad for them, since they'd mostly have been killed (again) in
the second assault.

If the bubble *created* the loop effect (in the same way it made metal
into putty or a whole suburb of the Rahad [or whereverthefuck] into
crumbling dust), and only lasted a few hours (as bubbles tended to do)
but left behind a permanently-changed condition, then it wouldn't have
broken the spell when the Dark One was sealed away. So they would
still be in the loop, and would have to wait for Randin and his
Pattern-fixing mojo to come and fix shit up.

Maybe that's what Randin is going to be doing for the foreseeable
future.

Mind you, we don't know that a bubble really does leave a permanent
effect. In cases where things came to life and attacked people, they
weren't brought permanently to life. They were alive until "killed",
and that was it. Maybe if they'd been left un-killed, they would have
stayed that way? Or maybe the effect only lasted for a short time and
the bubble burst. Either way, it seemed like Hinderstap was a
particularly lingering (or permanent-area-effect) bubble.

I wonder what would have happened if the Dreadlords had used balefire
on them? After all, they were under orders to destroy the Pattern as
much as possible by using balefire all over the place. Would the
Hinderstapians still have resurrected?

Post by TB
How did the Red Handers get trapped in Hinderstap anyway?

Because they went there, in a previous book. And were killed there (or
died of their wounds afterwards, and subsequently vanished). Anyone
killed in Hinderstap gets resurrected there. At least as long as the
bubble holds. That's how Mat found out about the place.

I believe the chapter was called "Hinderstap".





- ***@w

[TB]

Post by Chucky @ Work
On Mon, 11 Mar 2013 22:50:09 -0700 (PDT), TB

Post by TB
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During the Last Battle, the 500 people of Hinderstap, backed up by 100
Band of the Red Handers, sally forth to battle the Trollocs at a
river.  Of course, they are all slaughtered.  Then the next morning at
dawn, Jur Grady makes a Gateway to Hinderstap, and the resurrected
populace of Hinderstap, plus the Red Handers, pour through the Gateway
to attack the stunned Dreadlords!  They kill the Dreadlords, allowing
Jur to undam the river to flood out a bunch of Trollocs downriver.  On
that very same day at noon, Rand reforges the DO's prison, cutting him
off from the world.

What I was wondering was, presumably before those people were
resurrected in Hinderstap and came back out of the gateway to attack
all over again, their bodies would have vanished from the previous
attack. So unless the Dreadlords wiped them all out completely (no
bodies), there would have been some mysterious body-vanishings.
At the very least, some suddenly-hungry Trollocs as their dinner
vanished.

Post by TB
Did the Hinderstap resurrection spell last long
enough to resurrect the Hinderstappers and the Rand Handers the
morning AFTER the Last Battle?

There's the question, sure enough. If the bubble was still active and
that was what was resurrecting them, then it would have stopped when
the Dark One was sealed off, and they would all remain in whatever
state (dead or alive, but not perpetually-looped) they were in at that
moment. Sad for them, since they'd mostly have been killed (again) in
the second assault.
If the bubble *created* the loop effect (in the same way it made metal
into putty or a whole suburb of the Rahad [or whereverthefuck] into
crumbling dust), and only lasted a few hours (as bubbles tended to do)
but left behind a permanently-changed condition, then it wouldn't have
broken the spell when the Dark One was sealed away. So they would
still be in the loop, and would have to wait for Randin and his
Pattern-fixing mojo to come and fix shit up.
Maybe that's what Randin is going to be doing for the foreseeable
future.
Mind you, we don't know that a bubble really does leave a permanent
effect. In cases where things came to life and attacked people, they
weren't brought permanently to life. They were alive until "killed",
and that was it. Maybe if they'd been left un-killed, they would have
stayed that way? Or maybe the effect only lasted for a short time and
the bubble burst. Either way, it seemed like Hinderstap was a
particularly lingering (or permanent-area-effect) bubble.
I wonder what would have happened if the Dreadlords had used balefire
on them? After all, they were under orders to destroy the Pattern as
much as possible by using balefire all over the place. Would the
Hinderstapians still have resurrected?

Post by TB
How did the Red Handers get trapped in Hinderstap anyway?

Because they went there, in a previous book. And were killed there (or
died of their wounds afterwards, and subsequently vanished). Anyone
killed in Hinderstap gets resurrected there. At least as long as the
bubble holds. That's how Mat found out about the place.
I believe the chapter was called "Hinderstap".

I thought that Mat et al had escaped Hinderstap during "A Night In
Hinderstap".

[TB]

Post by TB

Post by Chucky @ Work
On Mon, 11 Mar 2013 22:50:09 -0700 (PDT), TB

Post by TB
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During the Last Battle, the 500 people of Hinderstap, backed up by 100
Band of the Red Handers, sally forth to battle the Trollocs at a
river.  Of course, they are all slaughtered.  Then the next morning at
dawn, Jur Grady makes a Gateway to Hinderstap, and the resurrected
populace of Hinderstap, plus the Red Handers, pour through the Gateway
to attack the stunned Dreadlords!  They kill the Dreadlords, allowing
Jur to undam the river to flood out a bunch of Trollocs downriver.  On
that very same day at noon, Rand reforges the DO's prison, cutting him
off from the world.

What I was wondering was, presumably before those people were
resurrected in Hinderstap and came back out of the gateway to attack
all over again, their bodies would have vanished from the previous
attack. So unless the Dreadlords wiped them all out completely (no
bodies), there would have been some mysterious body-vanishings.
At the very least, some suddenly-hungry Trollocs as their dinner
vanished.

Post by TB
Did the Hinderstap resurrection spell last long
enough to resurrect the Hinderstappers and the Rand Handers the
morning AFTER the Last Battle?

There's the question, sure enough. If the bubble was still active and
that was what was resurrecting them, then it would have stopped when
the Dark One was sealed off, and they would all remain in whatever
state (dead or alive, but not perpetually-looped) they were in at that
moment. Sad for them, since they'd mostly have been killed (again) in
the second assault.
If the bubble *created* the loop effect (in the same way it made metal
into putty or a whole suburb of the Rahad [or whereverthefuck] into
crumbling dust), and only lasted a few hours (as bubbles tended to do)
but left behind a permanently-changed condition, then it wouldn't have
broken the spell when the Dark One was sealed away. So they would
still be in the loop, and would have to wait for Randin and his
Pattern-fixing mojo to come and fix shit up.
Maybe that's what Randin is going to be doing for the foreseeable
future.
Mind you, we don't know that a bubble really does leave a permanent
effect. In cases where things came to life and attacked people, they
weren't brought permanently to life. They were alive until "killed",
and that was it. Maybe if they'd been left un-killed, they would have
stayed that way? Or maybe the effect only lasted for a short time and
the bubble burst. Either way, it seemed like Hinderstap was a
particularly lingering (or permanent-area-effect) bubble.
I wonder what would have happened if the Dreadlords had used balefire
on them? After all, they were under orders to destroy the Pattern as
much as possible by using balefire all over the place. Would the
Hinderstapians still have resurrected?

Post by TB
How did the Red Handers get trapped in Hinderstap anyway?

Because they went there, in a previous book. And were killed there (or
died of their wounds afterwards, and subsequently vanished). Anyone
killed in Hinderstap gets resurrected there. At least as long as the
bubble holds. That's how Mat found out about the place.
I believe the chapter was called "Hinderstap".

I thought that Mat et al had escaped Hinderstap during "A Night In
Hinderstap".

What would happen if a Trolloc, Fade, or Drakar died in Hinderstap at
night? Would it wake up in a hotel bed the next morning?

Ditto for Ogiers.

[Chucky @ Work]

On Tue, 12 Mar 2013 18:07:13 -0700 (PDT), TB

Post by TB

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What would happen if a Trolloc, Fade, or Drakar died in Hinderstap at
night? Would it wake up in a hotel bed the next morning?
Ditto for Ogiers.

I'm going to go with "yes, probably."



- ***@w

[David DeLaney]

Post by TB

Post by Chucky @ Work
Because they went there, in a previous book. And were killed there (or
died of their wounds afterwards, and subsequently vanished). Anyone
killed in Hinderstap gets resurrected there. At least as long as the
bubble holds. That's how Mat found out about the place.
I believe the chapter was called "Hinderstap".

I thought that Mat et al had escaped Hinderstap during "A Night In
Hinderstap".

Mat et al did not _die_ there. Some of the people with them did, though, I
think.

Dave

[Chucky @ Work]

Post by David DeLaney

Post by TB

Post by Chucky @ Work
Because they went there, in a previous book. And were killed there (or
died of their wounds afterwards, and subsequently vanished). Anyone
killed in Hinderstap gets resurrected there. At least as long as the
bubble holds. That's how Mat found out about the place.
I believe the chapter was called "Hinderstap".

I thought that Mat et al had escaped Hinderstap during "A Night In
Hinderstap".

Mat et al did not _die_ there. Some of the people with them did, though, I
think.

Yes, some of them. I didn't mean to imply that all of them did.
Otherwise, they all would have been stuck there.



- ***@w

[Timothy Bruening]

Post by David DeLaney

Post by TB

Post by Chucky @ Work
Because they went there, in a previous book. And were killed there (or
died of their wounds afterwards, and subsequently vanished). Anyone
killed in Hinderstap gets resurrected there. At least as long as the
bubble holds. That's how Mat found out about the place.
I believe the chapter was called "Hinderstap".

I thought that Mat et al had escaped Hinderstap during "A Night In
Hinderstap".

Mat et al did not _die_ there. Some of the people with them did, though, I
think.

Surely not 100 of them!

[Chucky @ Work]

On Tue, 12 Mar 2013 13:34:13 -0700 (PDT), TB

Post by TB

Post by Chucky @ Work

Post by TB
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How did the Red Handers get trapped in Hinderstap anyway?

Because they went there, in a previous book. And were killed there (or
died of their wounds afterwards, and subsequently vanished). Anyone
killed in Hinderstap gets resurrected there. At least as long as the
bubble holds. That's how Mat found out about the place.
I believe the chapter was called "Hinderstap".

I thought that Mat et al had escaped Hinderstap during "A Night In
Hinderstap".

Could be, I don't recall the name of the chapter exactly.

But not all of them escaped. Some of them were killed there, some died
later of their wounds, and vanished.



- ***@w

[TB]

What would happen if two damane grabbed eachother's leashes?

What would happen if someone hung a foxhead medallion on a damane?

What would happen if a damane/sul'dam pair entered a stedding or Far
Madding?

[David DeLaney]

Post by TB
What would happen if two damane grabbed eachother's leashes?

A scene they couldn't print in the books because CHILDREN might READ THEM
young man.

Post by TB
What would happen if a damane/sul'dam pair entered a stedding or Far
Madding?

Best guess: leash would still bind (Things still Work inside there). Damane
would not be able to channel and neither would leashed one.

Dave

[TB]

Post by David DeLaney

Post by TB
What would happen if two damane grabbed eachother's leashes?

A scene they couldn't print in the books because CHILDREN might READ THEM
young man.

Post by TB
What would happen if a damane/sul'dam pair entered a stedding or Far
Madding?

Best guess: leash would still bind (Things still Work inside there). Damane
would not be able to channel and neither would leashed one.

If Nynaeve filled up one of her Saidar Wells with Saidar and took it
into a stedding, would she be able to channel using the stored Saidar?

Are there such Wells for men?

[Chucky @ Work]

On Sat, 18 May 2013 11:29:44 -0700 (PDT), TB

Post by TB

Post by David DeLaney

Post by TB
What would happen if two damane grabbed eachother's leashes?

A scene they couldn't print in the books because CHILDREN might READ THEM
young man.

Post by TB
What would happen if a damane/sul'dam pair entered a stedding or Far
Madding?

Best guess: leash would still bind (Things still Work inside there). Damane
would not be able to channel and neither would leashed one.

If Nynaeve filled up one of her Saidar Wells with Saidar and took it
into a stedding, would she be able to channel using the stored Saidar?

Pretty sure it's the same effect as Far Madding's no-fly zone, so
yeah.

Post by TB
Are there such Wells for men?

Again, pretty sure. I thought Rand used one at one point. Or they are
the same, Wells can be used for either saidar or saidin. *shrug*




***@w

[TB]

Post by Chucky @ Work
On Sat, 18 May 2013 11:29:44 -0700 (PDT), TB

Post by TB

Post by David DeLaney

Post by TB
What would happen if two damane grabbed eachother's leashes?

A scene they couldn't print in the books because CHILDREN might READ THEM
young man.

Post by TB
What would happen if a damane/sul'dam pair entered a stedding or Far
Madding?

Best guess: leash would still bind (Things still Work inside there). Damane
would not be able to channel and neither would leashed one.

If Nynaeve filled up one of her Saidar Wells with Saidar and took it
into a stedding, would she be able to channel using the stored Saidar?

Pretty sure it's the same effect as Far Madding's no-fly zone, so
yeah.

Post by TB
Are there such Wells for men?

Again, pretty sure. I thought Rand used one at one point. Or they are
the same, Wells can be used for either saidar or saidin. *shrug*

Can Mat's foxhead medallion protect him from balefire?

[Cassie]

Post by TB

Post by Chucky @ Work
On Sat, 18 May 2013 11:29:44 -0700 (PDT), TB

Post by TB

Post by David DeLaney

Post by TB
What would happen if two damane grabbed eachother's leashes?

A scene they couldn't print in the books because CHILDREN might READ THEM
young man.

Post by TB
What would happen if a damane/sul'dam pair entered a stedding or Far
Madding?

Best guess: leash would still bind (Things still Work inside there). Damane
would not be able to channel and neither would leashed one.

If Nynaeve filled up one of her Saidar Wells with Saidar and took it
into a stedding, would she be able to channel using the stored Saidar?

Pretty sure it's the same effect as Far Madding's no-fly zone, so
yeah.

Post by TB
Are there such Wells for men?

Again, pretty sure. I thought Rand used one at one point. Or they are
the same, Wells can be used for either saidar or saidin. *shrug*

Can Mat's foxhead medallion protect him from balefire?

Spoiler alert!













The answer to that question you can read in the final book.

Cassie

[TB]

Post by Cassie

Post by TB

Post by Chucky @ Work
On Sat, 18 May 2013 11:29:44 -0700 (PDT), TB

Post by TB

Post by David DeLaney

Post by TB
What would happen if two damane grabbed eachother's leashes?

A scene they couldn't print in the books because CHILDREN might READ THEM
young man.

Post by TB
What would happen if a damane/sul'dam pair entered a stedding or Far
Madding?

Best guess: leash would still bind (Things still Work inside there). Damane
would not be able to channel and neither would leashed one.

If Nynaeve filled up one of her Saidar Wells with Saidar and took it
into a stedding, would she be able to channel using the stored Saidar?

Pretty sure it's the same effect as Far Madding's no-fly zone, so
yeah.

Post by TB
Are there such Wells for men?

Again, pretty sure. I thought Rand used one at one point. Or they are
the same, Wells can be used for either saidar or saidin. *shrug*

Can Mat's foxhead medallion protect him from balefire?

Spoiler alert!
The answer to that question you can read in the final book.

I do remember lots of balefire flying about, but I don't recall it
hitting anyone wearing a foxhead medallion.

[Timothy Bruening]

Post by David DeLaney

Post by TB
What would happen if two damane grabbed eachother's leashes?

A scene they couldn't print in the books because CHILDREN might READ THEM
young man.

Why would the leash grabbing be arousing?