Anyone here?

Discussion:

Anyone here?

(too old to reply)

styles

2023-07-20 20:47:02 UTC

I've been a big fan of the WoT series since I read the first book
way back in the 1990's, when I was just a wee lad. It was an
extremely cathartic experience to finally finish the series when
the last book came out.

I used to read this group back in those days. Recently I'm
resdiscovering Usenet, and glad to see this place is still around.

Is anyone still reading this NG? If so, what do you think about the
show adaptation on Amazon? It's enjoyable to me but I have mixed
feelings. Season 2 of the show premiers on 1 September!

Scott Lurndal

2023-07-21 14:26:01 UTC

Permalink

Post by styles
I've been a big fan of the WoT series since I read the first book
way back in the 1990's, when I was just a wee lad. It was an
extremely cathartic experience to finally finish the series when
the last book came out.
I used to read this group back in those days. Recently I'm
resdiscovering Usenet, and glad to see this place is still around.
Is anyone still reading this NG? If so, what do you think about the
show adaptation on Amazon? It's enjoyable to me but I have mixed
feelings. Season 2 of the show premiers on 1 September!

I had trouble getting past the changes to Perin's story, to the
extent that I haven't yet finished the first season.

styles

2023-07-22 02:15:50 UTC

Permalink

Post by Scott Lurndal
I had trouble getting past the changes to Perin's story, to the
extent that I haven't yet finished the first season.

It's true that the show deviates from the books in a lot of ways. Some
of which I find to not be a big deal, and some are complete
head-scratchers to me - in the books, they make a vague reference to a
romantic relationship between Moiraine and Siuan in their younger
years, the show devotes almost a whole damn episode to it. I'll still
watch it but it's definitely not a perfect representation.

Nicolas George

2023-07-22 08:31:54 UTC

Permalink

Post by styles
It's true that the show deviates from the books in a lot of ways. Some
of which I find to not be a big deal, and some are complete
head-scratchers to me - in the books, they make a vague reference to a
romantic relationship between Moiraine and Siuan in their younger
years, the show devotes almost a whole damn episode to it. I'll still
watch it but it's definitely not a perfect representation.

There is no such thing as a “perfect representation” of a novel into film or
TV series: the media have different strengths and limitations, and demand
different techniques of storytelling.

For example, in book form, earing characters' inner monologue usually works
rather well. In film, it can be quite awkward. Just watch David Lynch's Dune
to realize how awkward it can be. One of the authors of The Expanse, who
also was importantly involved in the writing of the TV adaptation, explained
that in a part of the story, showing Holden's nervousness didn't work so
they changed it to tensions between the members of the crew.

In book, infodump is easier too. You can have a map, it takes only one page,
and the readers will refer to it whenever they feel lost. You can't do the
same thing, at best you can zoom in and out on the map during the opening
credits and hope the viewers get a feel of the land instead of
fast-forwarding to the episode. So story lines have often to be simplified
for video.

Once you have thought about these constraints for a while, you realize a lot
of changes in adaptation were necessary — not all, mind you, of course, but
a lot.

In this instance, I am mostly worried about the erasure of the saidin /
saidar split and the “the Dragon might be a woman” tidbit. Of course, the
necessity of it is obvious, even if it is not for storytelling reasons: a
story where gender is an essential binary property of the soul and never
ever mismatches sex unless the Dark One gets involved, in 2022… yeah. But
good luck reconciling that with the major points of the plot. Let us hope
and see.

styles

2023-07-29 05:04:42 UTC

Permalink

Post by Nicolas George

Post by styles
It's true that the show deviates from the books in a lot of ways.
Some of which I find to not be a big deal, and some are complete
head-scratchers to me - in the books, they make a vague reference
to a romantic relationship between Moiraine and Siuan in their
younger years, the show devotes almost a whole damn episode to it.
I'll still watch it but it's definitely not a perfect
representation.

There is no such thing as a “perfect representation” of a novel into
film or TV series: the media have different strengths and
limitations, and demand different techniques of storytelling.
For example, in book form, earing characters' inner monologue usually
works rather well. In film, it can be quite awkward. Just watch David
Lynch's Dune to realize how awkward it can be. One of the authors of
The Expanse, who also was importantly involved in the writing of the
TV adaptation, explained that in a part of the story, showing
Holden's nervousness didn't work so they changed it to tensions
between the members of the crew.
In book, infodump is easier too. You can have a map, it takes only
one page, and the readers will refer to it whenever they feel lost.
You can't do the same thing, at best you can zoom in and out on the
map during the opening credits and hope the viewers get a feel of the
land instead of fast-forwarding to the episode. So story lines have
often to be simplified for video.
Once you have thought about these constraints for a while, you
realize a lot of changes in adaptation were necessary — not all, mind
you, of course, but a lot.
In this instance, I am mostly worried about the erasure of the saidin
/ saidar split and the “the Dragon might be a woman” tidbit. Of
course, the necessity of it is obvious, even if it is not for
storytelling reasons: a story where gender is an essential binary
property of the soul and never ever mismatches sex unless the Dark
One gets involved, in 2022… yeah. But good luck reconciling that with
the major points of the plot. Let us hope and see.

You are absolutely correct in many of your points. There really was no
possible way that we would ever have a 1 to 1 re-creation of the books,
and a lot of content would have to be removed in order to make the TV
series feasible. That being said, I do question some of the decisions
that were made for the TV series. Why did Perrin have to have a wife?
Why is the romance between Moiraine and Siuan so heavily emphasized? In
the books, it was basically a sentence about how they used to be
"pillow friends" when they were training in the tower; in the show it
seemed that they devoted just about a whole episode to this. Why did
Mat go from a prankster in the books to a thief on the show? (stealing
jewelry and trying to resell it to Fain)

I'm still optimistic for the next season, but I'm hoping that some of
these "creative" decisions are toned down a bit. If it goes too far,
the show won't be Wheel of Time, it'll be something else.

jjvors

2023-07-29 22:05:15 UTC

Permalink

Post by styles

Post by Nicolas George

Post by styles
It's true that the show deviates from the books in a lot of ways.
Some of which I find to not be a big deal, and some are complete
head-scratchers to me - in the books, they make a vague reference
to a romantic relationship between Moiraine and Siuan in their
younger years, the show devotes almost a whole damn episode to it.
I'll still watch it but it's definitely not a perfect
representation.

There is no such thing as a “perfect representation” of a novel into
film or TV series: the media have different strengths and
limitations, and demand different techniques of storytelling.
For example, in book form, earing characters' inner monologue usually
works rather well. In film, it can be quite awkward. Just watch David
Lynch's Dune to realize how awkward it can be. One of the authors of
The Expanse, who also was importantly involved in the writing of the
TV adaptation, explained that in a part of the story, showing
Holden's nervousness didn't work so they changed it to tensions
between the members of the crew.
In book, infodump is easier too. You can have a map, it takes only
one page, and the readers will refer to it whenever they feel lost.
You can't do the same thing, at best you can zoom in and out on the
map during the opening credits and hope the viewers get a feel of the
land instead of fast-forwarding to the episode. So story lines have
often to be simplified for video.
Once you have thought about these constraints for a while, you
realize a lot of changes in adaptation were necessary — not all, mind
you, of course, but a lot.
In this instance, I am mostly worried about the erasure of the saidin
/ saidar split and the “the Dragon might be a woman” tidbit. Of
course, the necessity of it is obvious, even if it is not for
storytelling reasons: a story where gender is an essential binary
property of the soul and never ever mismatches sex unless the Dark
One gets involved, in 2022… yeah. But good luck reconciling that with
the major points of the plot. Let us hope and see.

You are absolutely correct in many of your points. There really was no
possible way that we would ever have a 1 to 1 re-creation of the books,
and a lot of content would have to be removed in order to make the TV
series feasible. That being said, I do question some of the decisions
that were made for the TV series. Why did Perrin have to have a wife?
Why is the romance between Moiraine and Siuan so heavily emphasized? In
the books, it was basically a sentence about how they used to be
"pillow friends" when they were training in the tower; in the show it
seemed that they devoted just about a whole episode to this. Why did
Mat go from a prankster in the books to a thief on the show? (stealing
jewelry and trying to resell it to Fain)
I'm still optimistic for the next season, but I'm hoping that some of
these "creative" decisions are toned down a bit. If it goes too far,
the show won't be Wheel of Time, it'll be something else.

The more I hear from Jordan fans about the TV show, the more I'm glad I skipped it.

I skipped it because the reported changes to Perrin were completely outside his character. There were some rumors of changes to Mat as well.

You can't have the same story if you change the characters. Both the LotR and Harry Potter adaptations were faithful to the characters and were beloved for that.

But it seems no one cares about Jordan's characterizations. Yet it was the characters that kept me going through 14 volumes of the series.

Why, O why? I wonder if they realize they lost millions of Jordan fan and degraded their product as well?

I've been a habitue of this bulletin board since at least 1996, maybe 1995. I still subscribe to it.

Timothy Bruening

2023-08-07 21:20:14 UTC

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TV series Spoilers:

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Post by styles

Post by Scott Lurndal
I had trouble getting past the changes to Perin's story, to the
extent that I haven't yet finished the first season.

However, having Perrin KILL his wife seemed to be over the top!

Timothy Bruening

2023-08-07 19:52:09 UTC

Permalink

I liked the idea of a LADY Dragon Reborn!

2023-08-07 20:38:45 UTC

Permalink

TV spoilers:

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I don't like the damane balls.